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ysun  Identity Verified
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Wow Sep 13, 2014

Ying Wang wrote:

其实,我家前院、后院的植物,灌木、乔木,花花、草草,叫得出名、叫不出名的,有二十几种,但是,竹,是我儿时的记忆,我在竹林中玩耍,听布谷鸟的歌唱;看老人们用竹笋壳纳鞋底,等叔叔把一段竹子变成竹笛...... 很多时候,人的选择不是靠理性的,不过,我会借鉴孙先生的做法,理性地思考怎样把竹子种好,又不致泛滥成灾。

原来你家前院、后院是个百花园、百草园!难怪鹿会光顾你家后院。我很理解你对竹子的偏爱、对儿时记忆的眷恋。等你的竹子长大成林之后,不知会不会把熊猫招来?


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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韭菜 Sep 13, 2014

Speaking of 韭菜, some restaurants refer to them as Chinese chives, others refer to them as Chinese leeks. As Yueyin mentioned, Chinese chives are similar to but different than the chives used as an herb in Western cooking.

BTW, I've always wondered if leeks were even available in China. When I was in China, I had never seen them sold anywhere.


http://www.marthastewart.com/274312/leek-recipes/@center/276955/seasonal-produce-recipe-guide




[Edited at 2014-09-14 00:03 GMT]


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QHE
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European leeks Sep 13, 2014


Leeks are a member of the onion family. Despite sometimes being called "a poor man's asparagus," the thick stalked European leeks commonly found in supermarkets have a mild sweet flavor. Chinese leeks, on the other hand, are smaller and thinner, resembling a thick scallion. Their more pungent flavor makes Chinese leeks are a staple ingredient in northern Chinese cooking.


http://chinesefood.about.com/od/vegetablesrecipes/ig/Chinese-Vegetables-Pictures/leek_photo.htm

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=26


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Ying Wang  Identity Verified
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哪里,哪里 Sep 13, 2014

ysun wrote:

Ying Wang wrote:

其实,我家前院、后院的植物,灌木、乔木,花花、草草,叫得出名、叫不出名的,有二十几种,但是,竹,是我儿时的记忆,我在竹林中玩耍,听布谷鸟的歌唱;看老人们用竹笋壳纳鞋底,等叔叔把一段竹子变成竹笛...... 很多时候,人的选择不是靠理性的,不过,我会借鉴孙先生的做法,理性地思考怎样把竹子种好,又不致泛滥成灾。

原来你家前院、后院是个百花园、百草园!难怪鹿会光顾你家后院。我很理解你对竹子的偏爱、对儿时记忆的眷恋。等你的竹子长大成林之后,不知会不会把熊猫招来?


离百草园还差得远,而且没有一株是我种的。如果熊猫能够漂洋过海地来看我,我当然会很欢喜,不过还是我漂洋过海地去看牠们比较可行。


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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Chinese Leek Sep 13, 2014

QHE,

Thanks for the links. I don't think I've seen or tasted Chinese Leeks before then. Do you know what the Chinese name for a Chinese Leek is? Is it 韭葱?

I clicked through the images in that 1st link you provided. I believe the English name for 韭菜 was given as Chinese Garlic Chives.


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QHE
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Allium Porrum Sep 13, 2014

Steve,

我第一次在美国吃到 Leek,觉得味道缓和很不错。一直以为它可能是和国内的(山东)大葱是近亲。或许我孤陋寡闻,我没在国内见过叫 “韭葱” (扁葱)的葱。

百度上说,“韭葱” 20世纪30年代传入中国,广西栽培时间较长。说不定在广西那边常见。


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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Chinese Leeks Sep 13, 2014

QHE wrote:

Steve,

我第一次在美国吃到 Leek,觉得味道缓和很不错。一直以为它可能是和国内的(山东)大葱是近亲。或许我孤陋寡闻,我没在国内见过叫 “韭葱” (扁葱)的葱。

百度上说,“韭葱” 20世纪30年代传入中国,广西栽培时间较长。说不定在广西那边常见。


Yeah, I was wondering if the woman Chinese food expert in that link was referring to "大葱" too; 'cause I sure haven't seen or heard of 韭葱 either.



大葱


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ysun  Identity Verified
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乔迁之喜 Sep 14, 2014

Ying Wang wrote:

离百草园还差得远,而且没有一株是我种的。

你是否刚迁入新居?若是,我就在此恭贺乔迁之喜!


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David Lin  Identity Verified
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欧洲葱 -“京葱” vs. 中国葱 - “韭菜” and "献羔祭韭" Sep 14, 2014

QHE wrote:

Steve,
我第一次在美国吃到 Leek,觉得味道缓和很不错。一直以为它可能是和国内的(山东)大葱是近亲。或许我孤陋寡闻,我没在国内见过叫 “韭葱” (扁葱)的葱。

百度上说,“韭葱” 20世纪30年代传入中国,广西栽培时间较长。说不定在广西那边常见。


Hi Q, Steve and Ying,

Leek 在中国好像叫 “韭葱”、“扁葱”、“京葱” 或 “大葱” (如 Q 所说的山东大葱)。Wiki 有这样的描述:

韭葱多年生宿根草本,一般作二年生栽培;叶子扁而宽,叶鞘粗肥白嫩,层层包裹,呈圆筒形,称“葱白”;淡紫色花,丛集成球状,生于花茎顶端。

原产瑞士,分布於亚洲、欧洲以及中国的部分地区等地

可能由于原产瑞士,所以叫 European leak。

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leek

Ying Wang wrote: 韭菜长得很像一种兰花,您不觉得吗?不仔细去分辨,也不容易认出来。


韭菜的叶子的确很像兰花,也像 weed 的一种。(或者 weed 像它)

Wiki 如此描述:

韭菜 (Allium tuberosum)原產於中國;中国人种韭菜已经有 3000 多年歷史,在《诗经》中就有「献羔祭韭」的诗句;韭菜于 9 世纪传入日本,后逐渐传入东亚各国;今多在亞洲種植。

Allium tuberosum (commonly known as garlic chives, Chinese chives, Oriental garlic, Chinese leek, also known by the Chinese name kow choi (also transliterated as gau choy; Chinese: 韭菜; pinyin: Jiǔcài; Wade–Giles: Chiu3-ts'ai4; Jyutping: gau2 coi3), or the Japanese name nira, is a vegetable related to onion.

The Chinese name for the species is variously adapted and transliterated as cuchay, jiucai, kucai, kuchay, or kutsay in Southeast Asian countries such as Indonesia, Malaysia and the Philippines.

In the northeatern states of India, Manipur, it is grown and used as a substitute to garlic and onion in cooking and goes by the name "maroi nakupi" . It is also sometimes called "green nira grass" where "nira" is Romanization of the Japanese word "韮" which means garlic chives.


韭菜外型像 weed,在太阳不多的地方,生长蔓延得特别快,一般人不容易认出是蔬菜的一种。Ying 应该不怕被人投诉在前院种菜。

还有,收割时,有点像拔杂草的样子。 邻居看见,可能还会觉得你很努力在打理花园呢。:)

由于种植容易,毋需特别功夫去照顾,英国这边很多华人都很喜欢种植,并互相赠送幼苗。前年一位朋友送来几株幼苗,现已开花结果,种子随风飘送,在园子其他部份也多生长。由于韭菜的蒜辣味道能驱蚊虫,我也随便让它蔓延;因此也减少使用杀虫药,比较环保。

也同时有机会在英国承传了中国 3,000 多年的文化。

[Edited at 2014-09-14 11:22 GMT]


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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European Leeks Sep 14, 2014

David,

Thanks for the wiki link. Previously while reading it, I found the following section of text particularly interesting. Like I said, I've been wondering for the longest time: are leeks even available in China?



Historical consumption

Bible commentators attribute the חציר specimen - acclaimed by the Israelites to be of abundance in Egypt - as the leek.(Glantz, Animal and plant life in the Torah, חי וצומח בתורה .p. 204) Dried specimens from archaeological sites in ancient Egypt, as well as wall carvings and drawings, led Zohary and Hopf to conclude the leek was a part of the Egyptian diet from at least the second millennium BCE onwards. They also allude to surviving texts that show it had been also grown in Mesopotamia from the beginning of the second millennium BCE.[8] The leek was the favorite vegetable of the Emperor Nero, who consumed it in soup or in oil, believing it beneficial to the quality of his voice.[9]

Cultural significance

The leek is one of the national emblems of Wales, worn along with the daffodil (in Welsh, the daffodil is known as "Peter's leek," Cenhinen Bedr) on St. David’s Day. According to one legend, King Cadwaladr of Gwynedd ordered his soldiers to identify themselves by wearing the vegetable on their helmets in an ancient battle against the Saxons that took place in a leek field.[10] The Elizabethan poet Michael Drayton stated , in contrast, that the tradition was a tribute to Saint David, who ate only leeks when he was fasting.[11] Whatever the case, the leek has been known to be a symbol of Wales for a long time; Shakespeare, for example, refers to the custom of wearing a leek as an “ancient tradition” in Henry V. In the play, Henry tells the Welsh officer Fluellen that he too is wearing a leek “for I am Welsh, you know, good countryman.” The 1985 and 1990 British one pound coins bear the design of a leek in a coronet, representing Wales.



大葱 might be related to European leeks horticulturally; but IMO, appearance-wise and taste-wise they are very different. The Chinese food expert in the link QHE provided mentioned that Chinese leeks are a staple ingredient in northern Chinese cooking, but the image in the link seemed to be that of a European leek (Or is it that of a stalk of 大葱?) That's what made me even more confused.

My main hangup is probably this: leeks seem to belong to the subspecies of 韭(leek), while 大葱 seem to belong to that of 葱(scallion) - BTW, this might all sound like mumbo jumbo, since I know next to nothing about biology.

Anyway, whether leek or scallion ... it's not important. Leeks are delicious, and definitely a lot milder than 大葱. Taste-wise, I feel they taste closer to 韭菜 than to 葱. IMO it's worth a try for those who could get their hands on them.


[Edited at 2014-09-14 14:44 GMT]


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David Lin  Identity Verified
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History of Leeks Sep 14, 2014

wherestip wrote:

David,

Thanks for the wiki link. Previously while reading it, I was particularly interested in the following passages. Like I said, I've been wondering for the longest time: are leeks even available in China?

Historical consumption

Bible commentators attribute the חציר specimen - acclaimed by the Israelites to be of abundance in Egypt - as the leek.(Glantz, Animal and plant life in the Torah, חי וצומח בתורה .p. 204) Dried specimens from archaeological sites in ancient Egypt, as well as wall carvings and drawings, led Zohary and Hopf to conclude the leek was a part of the Egyptian diet from at least the second millennium BCE onwards. They also allude to surviving texts that show it had been also grown in Mesopotamia from the beginning of the second millennium BCE.[8] The leek was the favorite vegetable of the Emperor Nero, who consumed it in soup or in oil, believing it beneficial to the quality of his voice.[9]

Cultural significance

The leek is one of the national emblems of Wales, worn along with the daffodil (in Welsh, the daffodil is known as "Peter's leek," Cenhinen Bedr) on St. David’s Day. According to one legend, King Cadwaladr of Gwynedd ordered his soldiers to identify themselves by wearing the vegetable on their helmets in an ancient battle against the Saxons that took place in a leek field.[10] The Elizabethan poet Michael Drayton stated , in contrast, that the tradition was a tribute to Saint David, who ate only leeks when he was fasting.[11] Whatever the case, the leek has been known to be a symbol of Wales for a long time; Shakespeare, for example, refers to the custom of wearing a leek as an “ancient tradition” in Henry V. In the play, Henry tells the Welsh officer Fluellen that he too is wearing a leek “for I am Welsh, you know, good countryman.” The 1985 and 1990 British one pound coins bear the design of a leek in a coronet, representing Wales.



Very interesting indeed about the biblical history and the Welsh connection, particularly its relationship to St. David's Day.

In the Old Testament Numbers 11:5, the Israelites could recall:

"We remember the fish, which we did eat in Egypt freely; the cucumbers, and the melons, and the leeks, and the onions, and the garlick."

“我们记得在埃及的时候,不花钱就可以吃鱼,还有黄瓜、西瓜、韭菜、葱、蒜。”(和合本修订版)

It's proved its at least more than 2,000 years of history in the Middle East then.

As to the British one-pound coin, the image is shown below.

a leek in the crown!

1_pound_1985_Wales

http://www.royalmint.com/discover/uk-coins/coin-design-and-specifications/one-pound-coin/1985-leek

[Edited at 2014-09-14 12:54 GMT]


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David Lin  Identity Verified
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葱或韭 Sep 14, 2014

wherestip wrote:

大葱 might be related to European leeks horticulturally; but IMO, appearance-wise and taste-wise they are very different. The Chinese food expert in the link QHE provided mentioned that Chinese leeks are a staple ingredient in northern Chinese cooking, but the image in the link seemed to be that of a European leek (Or is it that of a stalk of 大葱?) That's what made me even more confused.

My main hangup is probably this: leeks seem to belong to the subspecies of 韭(leek), while 大葱 seem to belong to that of 葱(scallion) - BTW, this might all sound like mumbo jumbo, since I know next to nothing about biology.

Anyway, whether leek or scallion ... it's not important. Leeks are delicious, and definitely a lot milder than 大葱. Taste-wise, I feel they taste closer to 韭菜 than to 葱. IMO it's worth a try for those who could get their hands on them.



我也察觉到英国/欧洲的 leeks 比中国的大葱/京葱的体积大一些。只需看一英镑货币图案可知。光葱白部份,就比国内的粗大得多。还有,如你所说,中国京葱味道较重更浓,而欧洲的较淡。本地华人取其样子像葱而体积却较大,因此都叫大葱,而非韭菜。韭菜则是像兰花草,可以变成韭黄卖那一种,用来区别。

无论葱或韭,我都喜欢吃,尤其用欧洲大葱来炒牛肉片,非常美味且健康!

至于韭菜,用来炒蛋饼或造韭菜饺也很可口。只是坊间传闻男性不能多吃。


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QHE
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Allium 属 Sep 14, 2014

wherestip wrote:
大葱 might be related to European leeks horticulturally; but IMO, appearance-wise and taste-wise they are very different.


是这样的。除了形状大小多少有区别外,Leek 的叶子比大葱的要硬, 好象含更多纤维 。Leek 和韭黄对我来讲更合个人口味 。:)

P.S.,
韭菜 Genus: Allium ; Species: A. tuberosum

韭葱 (Leek) Genus: Allium; Species: A. ampeloprasum (Species synonymy, porrum)

大葱 Genus: Allium; Species: A. fistulosum (giganteum Makion)


David Lin wrote:

我也察觉到英国/欧洲的 leeks 比中国的大葱/京葱的体积大一些。


通常是这样,也有例外:

http://news.sina.com.cn/s/2007-11-09/005114265628.shtml


********

The Life of King Henry the Fifth
William Shakespeare

SCENE VII. Another part of the field.

FLUELLEN
Your majesty says very true: if your majesties is
remembered of it, the Welshmen did good service in a
garden where leeks did grow, wearing leeks in their
Monmouth caps; which, your majesty know, to this
hour is an honorable badge of the service; and I do
believe your majesty takes no scorn to wear the leek
upon Saint Tavy's day (Saint David's Day).





[Edited at 2014-09-14 20:52 GMT]


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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Great Sep 15, 2014

QHE,

Thanks a lot for the expert research for the scientific names. That was very helpful.


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wherestip  Identity Verified
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Now that's progress, isn't it? Sep 15, 2014

http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/15/world/asia/china-cellphone-sidewalk/index.html?hpt=hp_t2



Hong Kong (CNN) -- Tired of bumping into people glued to their phones? One Chinese city thinks it has the answer: It has divided a sidewalk on one of its busiest streets into two lanes -- one for cellphone users and the other for those without.
The sidewalk is in the city of Chongqing in southwestern China. Fifty meters long and three meters wide, it has warning signs painted in white on the ground.
Long Cheng, a spokesperson for the developer that came up with the idea, said that the sidewalk lanes reminded tourists not to walk while playing with their cellphones.
"It's an unsafe gesture with potential safety hazards," she said.
The road, known as "yangrenjie" or foreigners street, is a popular tourist attraction in the city because of its faux Western architecture and an amusement park.
Long said the developers were inspired by a recent experiment in Washington DC and there were no plans yet to roll out the concept elsewhere in the city.



First we have to deal with bike lanes, now it's the idea of cellphone lanes. Where does the idiocy stop?

BTW, I know I'm not being politically correct. But compared to "yangrenjie", I think I'm still okay.


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