| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | To be or not to be (a full member) Thread poster: Rad Graban (X)
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jacana54 (X) 
Uruguay
English to Spanish
+ ...
| look at this | Oct 18, 2008 |
Hi, Rad,
Have you seen the comparative chart?
http://www.proz.com/?sp=info/prem&inquire=1&viewPage=features
I have spent fortunes over the years drinking coffee with other lawyers, colleagues, with whom we talked over our cases, learnt from each other and had our good laughs. During that time I paid for the coffee but not for the rent of... See more Hi, Rad,
Have you seen the comparative chart?
http://www.proz.com/?sp=info/prem&inquire=1&viewPage=features
I have spent fortunes over the years drinking coffee with other lawyers, colleagues, with whom we talked over our cases, learnt from each other and had our good laughs. During that time I paid for the coffee but not for the rent of the bar.
Nowdays I drink my own coffee and I am happy to pay Proz for giving me the "place" where I meet colleagues.
Enjoy your weekend!
Lucía
[Edited at 2008-10-18 21:28] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Rad Graban (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:38
English to Slovak
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | I think my question was answered. Nothing. | Oct 18, 2008 |
Apart from Friderike Butler, nobody seemed to read my question properly. I was asking: "What more (than I already have), what satisfaction, can I get by paying". I am not asking generally. I'm asking in my case.
| | | | Dinny
Greece
Local time: 17:38
Italian to Danish
+ ...
| The Blue Board Pays For My Membership | Oct 19, 2008 |
I really use the Blue Board a lot. I cannot afford not to. And it has helped me to avoid customers I really liked to avoid, since I have no time to spend on chasing payments. Besides, whenever I have time for "marketing" I can check potential customers on the BB before approaching them.
In my short time as a non-paying member years ago I often wanted to know about a potential customer and I had to pay my 50 brownies each time - which by the way represent a cost in time spent, sinc... See more I really use the Blue Board a lot. I cannot afford not to. And it has helped me to avoid customers I really liked to avoid, since I have no time to spend on chasing payments. Besides, whenever I have time for "marketing" I can check potential customers on the BB before approaching them.
In my short time as a non-paying member years ago I often wanted to know about a potential customer and I had to pay my 50 brownies each time - which by the way represent a cost in time spent, since you have to be a very active non-paying member to earn them - and sometimes I did not have enough brownies to consult the Blue Board. I think that was the trigger that convinced me to be a paying member.
Besides that I am sure that all the little blue-ribbons-and-other-icons connected to my user name will convince any potential customer to choose me before a non-paying member with none of that.
You don't need to check your customers on the Blue Board and you have no need for "credentials" in the form of little icons to certify you as a genuine translator? By all means, save your 100 bucks... they might come in handy when you have to pay a solicitor to get your money. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Partial membership is also a sensible solution | Oct 19, 2008 |
I find that partial membership is also a good solution. It costs a lot less than full membership and lets you take advantage of the part of Proz that is important to you (there are two types of partial membership). At the same time you are 'helping' to pay for the site. You won't be able to become a "certified PRO' unless you pay the full amount, but if that doesn't matter (it's not an issue for everyone), then purchasing one of the partial membe... See more I find that partial membership is also a good solution. It costs a lot less than full membership and lets you take advantage of the part of Proz that is important to you (there are two types of partial membership). At the same time you are 'helping' to pay for the site. You won't be able to become a "certified PRO' unless you pay the full amount, but if that doesn't matter (it's not an issue for everyone), then purchasing one of the partial memberships may be an option for you.
http://www.proz.com/join?viewPage=partial_benefits
Correction: apparently partial membership is accepted for those who may be interested in applying for the P program
[Edited at 2008-10-19 12:31] ▲ Collapse
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John Rawlins
Spain
Local time: 16:38
Spanish to English
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| What can I give, rather than what do I get | Oct 19, 2008 |
Like any organisation and life in general, what you get from Proz usually reflects what you give.
| | | | | appearing in top search results | Oct 19, 2008 |
when a potential client searches for translators in a specific pair, paying members appear before non-paying members. This increases your chances of getting new clinets. It is like paying google to have your website appearing in top search results.
I went quickly through the replies and comments and I am not sure if somebody mentioned this before.
| | | | | Your logic reminds me very much of that of certain clients | Oct 19, 2008 |
There are certain clients (who are in the minority) who reason like this:
"Well, yes, I received a good quality translation from that translator, and certainly I am very happy with it, but there is no sense in paying for it for the following reasons:
(1) The amount involved is too small for him/her to pursue me for it legally;
(2) He/she is not the size of business who could report me to a credit reference agency for non-payment and thus affect my credit record; a... See more There are certain clients (who are in the minority) who reason like this:
"Well, yes, I received a good quality translation from that translator, and certainly I am very happy with it, but there is no sense in paying for it for the following reasons:
(1) The amount involved is too small for him/her to pursue me for it legally;
(2) He/she is not the size of business who could report me to a credit reference agency for non-payment and thus affect my credit record; and
(3) I do not expect to ever need his/her services again, since I have never needed a translation for any reason before and am unlikely to need one ever again;
THEREFORE, there is absolutely nothing to be gained from paying for the translation. Therefore it does not make sense to pay. Therefore I will not pay." ▲ Collapse
| | | | Uldis Liepkalns
Latvia
Local time: 17:38
Member (2003)
English to Latvian
+ ...
| Yes Astrid, "Decency" is the word | Oct 19, 2008 |
There are tens of thousands on non paying members on ProZ.com and that's fully OK by me.
But when some of them publicly proudly boast "why the heck should I spend a cent on this Site financed by you, when I can reap all I need from there just for free", it shapes my personal opinions on these persons.
Not that I expect them to care about that, of course...
Uldis
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| more contacts | Oct 19, 2008 |
when a potential client searches for translators in a specific pair, paying members appear before non-paying members. This increases your chances of getting new clinets. It is like paying google to have your website appearing in top search results.
I went quickly through the replies and comments and I am not sure if somebody mentioned this before.
This is the biggest reason I spring for a (partial) membership. Perhaps it is less important in a smaller language pair, but in SP>EN, where you are vying for attention against 15,000 or so other registered users, being a paid member and having a few ProZ points in your areas of specialization can put you right up in the top 20 or so, making it well worth the time and money it takes to acquire those things!
If you're totally happy with the volume of work you're getting and the rates your charging, there may be no real motivation for you to become a paying member.
But if this is to be believed--"Members are four times more likely than non-member site users to meet new clients. The disparity is growing as we create new member-only features, and as more people decide to join ProZ.com" (http://www.proz.com/faq/membership#plat_difference)--then a membership may increase the volume of client contacts you get through the site, and having more offers to choose from allows you to optimize your work volume and rates.
| | | | | Preposterous comparison | Oct 19, 2008 |
Astrid Elke Johnson wrote:
"Well, yes, I received a good quality translation from that translator, and certainly I am very happy with it, but there is no sense in paying for it for the following reasons:
(...)
THEREFORE, there is absolutely nothing to be gained from paying for the translation. Therefore it does not make sense to pay. Therefore I will not pay."
I'm sorry, but I find that an absurb comparison. You are talking about not paying for something that you do need. Breach of contract to boot, and thus, in essence, breaking the law.
Rad is talking about the complete polar opposite - paying for something that he does not need - and asking whether there are any ancillary or collateral benefits he may not have considered.
The two issues could not be more different.
The point about "making a contribution" and sense of community and so on is valid, up to a point. It rather depends on whether one's experience is that it is a community with equal give and take and suchlike. Rad contributes with Kudoz, let us not overlook that (and we shall never know if that contribution has led to other people joining the site - at the very least, it adds to traffic).
My experience in my pair is the sense of community is dwindling away to nothing. Too much take, not enough give.
Proz is not some happy-clappy commune of tree-huggers. It is a profit-making website run by a man with a fine head for business. It owes us nothing; we owe it nothing.
It should also be borne in mind (in my opinion) that generally speaking it is rare (non-existent? I've never seen it) for forums or Question-and-Answer areas of any kind of website to require payment. Registration, yes; payment, no. If we concede that Rad does not actually need any of the benefits paid membership brings, you are essentially recommending he pays for services he can get for nothing elsewhere. Or, as I said above, that he pays for something he does not need. Neither is particularly rational.
As you can probably tell, I'm with Rad on this one
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 16:38
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| The benefits are... | Oct 19, 2008 |
Rad Graban wrote:
- I have a fair bit of KudoZ points for my language combination.
This will help you get listed higher on a search, but the highest you can get will always be on the page after all the paid members. So the membership fee is for getting listed higher in a search. I see you have the most KudoZ points of any English-Slovak translator, but the highest you'll get on a default search is page 4 (number #67 in the list), and the highest you'll get on a specialised search is page 2. If you were a paid member, you'd be #6 on the first page even for a generic search.
What are the other benefits worth coughing out $100 that I am not aware of?
I can't think of any. Except maybe that some clients may have a different opinion of you if you state on your web site or CV that you're a paying user of ProZ.com.
I think the advice "try it for a year" is good. USD 120 is quite a lot of money for a gamble, agreed, but IMO you already know how to get the best out of the portal, so you won't be wasting your money if you decide to spend it here.
[Edited at 2008-10-19 13:53]
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 16:38
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| More comments, seeing that it is weekend | Oct 19, 2008 |
Marina Soldati wrote:
Somebody correct me if I´m wrong, please, but I´m almost sure Proz.com can host your website, either with your own domain or a subdomain withing Proz.com. ... If you have a website, you can compare the hosting costs among several providers of that service and Proz.com.
The type of "free" hosting that ProZ.com provides can be had for USD 20.00 per year, and I suspect you'll lose your hosting with ProZ.com when your membership expires, which means you'll have to move your site anyway.
If your web site with ProZ.com is not hosted on your own domain name but under the ProZ.com name, I suspect one advantage is near-instant search engine updates of changes on your page... but that applies to non-paying members' profile pages also.
Caryl Swift wrote:
You could also bear in mind that, possibly, more members might equal less need for advertisers - something that many people are vociferously disapproving of in these forums.
No. If it were true that paying a fee meant less advertisements, why do you and I (paying members) still see them? As a paying member I would not wish for no advertisements (for adverts help me stay aware of what goes on in the industry), but I would certainly wish for less annoying ones
Vitals wrote:
It gave me a chance to ask 15 questions a day (instead of just 5). It matters in some of my language pairs, as no decent dictionaries are available and sometimes I have to rely on the help of the experienced colleagues.
Well, you can set up a Yahoogroup or Google group for free, and then there's no limit to the number of questions you can ask. And there are over 500 Lithuanian translators on ProZ.com you can invite to such a list.
Friderike Butler wrote:
ProZ.com offers a lot of features and support on the non-paying member level that other sites charge for. I appreciate the notion to keep the services accessible for linguists on all walks of life including those who just start out and for whom $100 may truly be an enormous amount of money and those who see translations as a passion and do it part-time.
I suspect ProZ.com is so successful partly because of the value it offers non-paying members. In that sense, providing access to non-paying members is not simply charity (although I'm not saying staff isn't charitable), but simply good business practice. I'll wager that if ProZ.com stops or greatly reduces services to non-paying members, it will die the same slow death that many of the other portals are suffering (whose names forum rules prevent me from uttering).
Dinny wrote:
I really use the Blue Board a lot. I cannot afford not to. And it has helped me to avoid customers I really liked to avoid, since I have no time to spend on chasing payments. Besides, whenever I have time for "marketing" I can check potential customers on the BB before approaching them.
I'm glad to hear that; however, for me the Blue Board has had very little benefit. Most new clients who contact me are not on the Blue Board. A few of them hve been on Karin/David/Ted's list (whose name I probably can't mention either).
Charlie Bavington wrote:
It should also be borne in mind (in my opinion) that generally speaking it is rare (non-existent? I've never seen it) for forums or Question-and-Answer areas of any kind of website to require payment. Registration, yes; payment, no.
For forums, I agree. But for access to clients, ProZ.com is one of very few sites that allow non-paying members access to clients, or indeed clients access to non-paying members. In fact, with ProZ.com a non-paying member can create a profile page that exceeds the value of any paid member's, but with many other such portals, the non-paying members are often reduced to a single entry in a search, with paying members being given all the fancy, highly visible stuff.
I wish ProZ.com would lift that ban on mentioning competitive services in the forums. There are none so good as ProZ.com, so why worry?
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Rad Graban (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:38
English to Slovak
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Your point is? | Oct 19, 2008 |
Uldis Liepkalns wrote:
There are tens of thousands on non paying members on ProZ.com and that's fully OK by me.
But when some of them publicly proudly boast "why the heck should I spend a cent on this Site financed by you, when I can reap all I need from there just for free", it shapes my personal opinions on these persons.
Not that I expect them to care about that, of course...
Uldis
What is indescent about asking what do I get for my money?
| | | | Uldis Liepkalns
Latvia
Local time: 17:38
Member (2003)
English to Latvian
+ ...
| It was not intended to be personal | Oct 19, 2008 |
as we see this reasoning often enough - at least monthy.
Rad Graban wrote:
What is indescent about asking what do I get for my money?
Sure, nothing indecent in it, my apologies.
However your statement on previous page comes dangerously close to the example I mentioned:
Rad Graban wrote:
You have answered my question fully. I can be just as successful without paying as I can be by being a full member. I wouldn't be getting anything extra, contributing or helping any good cause for my $100. Discussion closed.
Uldis
| | | | | Give it a shot | Oct 19, 2008 |
Hello there!
I am a non-paying memeber for now...but most honestly I am having a hard time to find what I want ...unless I don't pay for.
It seems it doesn't cost that much...so I may decide to become a paying member for a while and then decide if it worths the money or not.
Cheers, Lore
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